Peer Assist

The following is a summary of Peer Assist requests for the year 2013. If you have any information you would like to share please get in touch with [email protected].

_____________________________

Subject:           JOIFF Peer Assist - Explosion Prevention/Suppression in Confined Areas Using Water Spray/Mist

Date of Email :  Wed 02/01/2013

Report Detail:

I am looking into the use of water spray / water mist to prevent / suppress explosions from flammable gasses in confined spaces.

I have studied the following literature:

  • New Developments in Explosion Protection Technology by Robert Zalosh
    Presentation at Fire and Emergency Services Asia 2005, Singapore, February 22– 26, 2005
  • Protecting against Vapor explosions with Water Mist by J. R. Mawhinney and R. Darwin of Hughes Associates, Inc.
    Halon Options Technical Working Conference 2-4 May 2000

I am looking for more publications on this topic and if JOIFF members have experience with testing and the (practical) use of water spray and/or waster mist for this specific application. Thier input is appreciated.

Please reply to:  [email protected] copy to [email protected]

_____________________________

Subject:          Raney Nickel - Video of Fire... 

Date of Email :  Mon 11/02/2013

Report Detail:

We are working on instructions to control simple fires from Raney Nickel after loss of containment from the storage drum when the product is no longer covered by water.   For this purpose we are looking for a video or any other footage of a Raney Nickel fire.  Raney Nickel develops a moderate fire while other metals from the same hazard group have a more violent reaction.  An image is worth more than a hundred words to show the difference.

Thank you in advance for your help.

Regards,

Jeanne van Buren,
Senior Consultant
Marsh Risk Consulting B.V
[email protected]

_____________________________

Subject:           Do you have any experience with the following PFP service supply company?

Date of Email :  Tue 12/03/2013

Report Detail:

Is it possible to ask the JOIFF membership the following questions relating to ‘OPUS SERVICES’ – much appreciated;

  1. What PFP type was applied and its rating (cementitious[dense or lightweight], intumescent, fibrous or blankets, boarding, mouldings or enclosures)?
  2. Make/manufacturer material applied?
  3. When and where in the world (geographically)?
  4. Was this an onshore or offshore application?
  5. Was the PFP applied to  a vessel, building, transformer bay, cable tray, column support, supporting structural steel etc.?
  6. What protection factor they achieved (1hr 2hr etc. ) ?
  7. Was this an A, J or H rating?

Many Thanks for your continued support to your fellow JOIFF members..

_____________________________

Subject:           Plastic Spill Pallets – Any Known Suppliers of Anti-Static Versions?

Date of Email :  Thu 21/03/2013

Report Detail:

Can you please oblige us and send out a JOIFF Peer Assist Request for us, as follows:

We are currently looking to purchase a number of Plastic Bunded Pallets (Spill Pallets) that MUST be certified as Anti-static. A number of local suppliers are offering similar pallets but none are Certified as Anti-static as per our requirements. Can any members recommend any suitable suppliers for same? Preferably in the UK/Ireland region but will also consider mainland Europe. Here are a few images of such pallets (courtesy of Google Images).

Thank you. Replies please to: [email protected]

_____________________________

Subject:           Plant Flares - Your Thoughts and Experience Required…

Date of Email :  

Report Detail:

I was hoping that you could pass on the under mentioned query to the JOIF members for inputs and best practices sharing with regards to plant flares. Comments on flare stacks are sought, but info on ground flares are also welcome. I get some challenging questions and arguments around fire incidents on flare stacks which include the following:

The flare stack structure is not designed to remain intact (i.e. may collapse if exposed to direct flame impingement). Flare stacks has a sterile area around it where no other equipment is permitted be placed, so theoretically a flare stack should never be exposed to a pool fire scenario, except in very abnormal cases where large volumes of liquid carry over happens.

The questions:
1.      Are there any recordings of flare stack collapses during fire situations and if so, where can literature on it be found?
2.      Does anyone have history on fires on flare stacks (except for the tip of course!)? What is the typical damage to the equipment?

Fire fighter readiness to address fires at flare systems.
Question:
1.      Has a flare collapse under fire conditions been identified as a credible scenario and has an emergency response plan/procedure been developed for it? Brief description of the main activities will suffice.

Fire protection measure for flare stacks.
Question:
1.      Apart from the normal fire protection for the knockout drum, i.e. spillage containment, fire extinguishers, fire hydrants and/or monitors, is it normal practice to provide curbing or bunding/diking around the base of the flare stack to make provision for spillages?
Thanking all members in advance!

Gert Lubbe:Fire Protection Specialist E-mail: [email protected]

_____________________________

Subject:          Any Experience with Explosive Demolition? 

Date of Email :  Wed 28/08/2013

Report Detail:

We are exploring options of removing an old process unit utilizing explosive demolition and imploding the structure.  Not my area of expertise.  Would any of the JOIFF Members have any expertise, experience, thoughts or know of regulation or subject matter experts on this?

Our contractor seems very confident but I would like to be armed with some knowledge to speak intelligently around this.  Any help from the members would be appreciated. Could you disseminate please?

William C. Kelly CFPS  - [email protected]

_____________________________

Subject:           Deluge Cooling Water Flow Rate for Storage Tanks, What is The Derivation ?

Date of Email :  Mon 14/10/2013

Report Detail:

In the Netherlands we use a best available technique guideline for the fire protection of storage tanks containing flammable and combustible products. For the purpose of this question assume the tanks are made of carbon steel and are at a distance of ½ a tank diameter from each other. The tanks contain flammable or combustible products.   The requirements for cooling tanks are the same for exposure to radiant heat and flame impingement as the operator must have provisions in place for rapid extinguishment of the fire. The tanks are required to have fixed cooling systems.

Cooling requirements
The cone / dome roof of the tank has to be cooled with 2 l/min/m2.
For the cylinder the cooling requirements are set to 17 l/min/for each meter of the circumference of the tank cylinder.
The very important precondition for this 17 liters is that the whole cylinder is covered with water at all times, this includes manholes and other structures incorporated in the tank cylinder. To accomplish this, additional deluge sprinklers can be necessary (at ½ of ¾ of the height of) the tank cylinder for taller tanks and for specific locations on the tanks.

Question for JOIFF members:
I like to consult JOIFF members about the source of this 17 liters.  Several decades ago they use 1000 l/hour/ for each meter of the circumference of the tank cylinder.  This roughly equals the 17 liters.

1.      Do any of the JOIFF members know the origin and reasoning behind the 1000 or 17 liter requirement?
2.      What is your experience with tanks exposed to radiant heat or flame impingement if the tank cylinder is not fully covered with water when the tank is full/half full/ nearly empty?

Thank you in advance for your reply.
Jeanne van Buren
Mailto:[email protected]

_____________________________

Subject:     Maintenance Standards for Fire Service Valves?      

Date of Email :  Sun 08/12/2013

Report Detail:

some assistance please

Is there any standard available that prescribes what period and what specific maintenance need to be done on fire hydrant valves as well as main valves in a fire ring main?  I have a discussion with maintenance shortly, and would welcome some advice from the JOIFF membership?

Regards:  Andre RABIE
Fire Fighting Manager ORPIC
[email protected]

_____________________________

Subject:           

Date of Email :  

Report Detail:

_____________________________

Subject:           Fire Pumps - What Engineering Standard Does Your Company Apply?

Date of Email :  Thu 04/04/2013

Report Detail:

What Engineering Standard Does Your Company Apply?

  • NFPA 20
  • NFPA 20 with 3rd Party or Listed approvals e.g. FM, UL, LPCB etc
  • Country specific e.g
  • CNBOP – Poland
  • TAC – India
  • SANS – South Africa
  • API 610
  • Other…

This straw poll of JOIFF member companies will provide some indication of what the industry norm is and where there are deviations. 

If it’s possible to state why that standard is applied that would be helpful, however, not necessary. Where it’s possible to share company information/standard that also would be helpful but not necessary

NB:  Please pass this on to your peer group outside of JOIFF for their input if possible

Many Thanks for a speedy response to this question